LT & HRM mismatch
Welcome to the Peak Performance forums!
To contribute to the discussions please either register here for free or login.
To access 20 years worth of Peak Performance downloads, articles, workouts as well as the locked members only forum click here to take a trial membership for $1.97
Useful Links: Quick Start Guide, Forum Guidelines, Terms and Conditions,Recent Activity…
20th Mar '06, 10:14pm
I am using a program by Outside magazine (http://outside.away.com/outside/bodywork/200205/200205shape_of_your_life.html), which I previously used and enjoyed because of its holistic approach to exercise, but I have reencountered a bit of a conundrum.
I just finished the lactate test and found my heart rate average for the 30 minute run to be 198 bpm (207 bpm max). So this then, as I understand it, would be my lactate threshold. As I am 24, my MHR comes out to be 196.6 (217-24 x .85). So here is the problem: how can my LT be at 101% of my MHR?
Does this mean that Iâm super fit?! :) Well, Iâm not in the worst shape, but Iâm certainly not in the best shape either. I know that everyoneâs LTâs vary, but I kind of doubt if anyone could have an LT of 100%. Am I making a mistake in my calculations, my way of thinking? Oh and I had about the same LT last year after my 30 minute run on a flat course using a different heart rate monitor.
Help disentangling my knotted mind would be much appreciated. Let me know if more info is needed. Thanks!
Nate
LT & HRM mismatch
28th Mar '06, 4:57am
Does anyone have any ideas or can anyone refer me somewhere? Thanks.
Re: LT & HRM mismatch
28th Mar '06, 6:16pm
Hey Nate,
Where did you do the lactate testing? and how did you get the results? I usually see/deal with LT in millimol per litres? Were you also advised of your lactate turning point (LTP)?
I also notice you are using the standard 220-age for MHR. This is a bit vague and I would strongly reccomend you change to the Karvonen theory (220-age-resting heart rate*training zone+resting heart rate).
It is also hard to advise when I do not know why you took the LT test in the first place? with a 30 min run I am guessing your an aerobic endurance runner? do you compete? what level? what distance?
Remember, heart rates are a popular intensity tool, and they are easy to measure. Therefore while LT and LTP have beneficial results, base your training around what you can regularly undertake, record and apply. In a previous PP Rahael Brandon wrote a good article on TRimps (training impulses), may be worth a look. If you like/need LT, try and find how to calculate what you need (including the hear rate stuff) and out it into a spreadsheet, that way you can allways update your testing results in the same way and keep a record of progressions.
Mail me if you want more help
D
Re: LT & HRM mismatch
1st Apr '06, 9:20pm
You are quite right - your LT cannot be at 101% of your HRmax.
There is clearly a problem here, so lets analyse your thinking and solve it for you.
A 30' run gave a measured mean PR of 197bpm and a maximum PR of 207bpm. These are measured values and therefore indisputable.
You then derived some information from this data.
Assumption 1 - 197bpm equates to your LT
Assumption 2 - you are 24 years old.
Assumption 3 - your HRmax is 217 minus age
Assumption 4 - your LT is 85% of Assumption 3
Lets examine these assumption in turn:
1: This is a reasonable assumption provided that you gave your all in the 30' test. Any holding back and the HR is too low.
2: You should confirm this with your mother - I often get race entries with wrong ages on them (admitedly often from veterans trying to get a greater age allowance or just plain senile)
3: There are many formulae purporting to derive HRmax - the most common one is 220 - age (pretty similar to your assumption), but this was derived during a train journey and is based on measured values for only SIX elite male runners. There are other, more complex formuae attempting to take into account the athlete's sport, gender, training level ...
Your formula evaluates your HRmax as 194bpm, but since your measured PR exceeds this, the formula is quite clearly inaccurate for you.
In fact this formula is inaccurate for at least 95% of the population.
Your actual PRmax is probably nearer to 212bpm. If you manage to measure this value, then I have under-estimated it.
To measure PRmax requires an all-out stress test under laboratory condition, and should only be carried out with a medical rescus. team in attendance and a defibrillator already wired to your chest.
4: LT is 85% HRmax is reasonable approximation, although for an athlete in an endurance sport where a steady effort is the norm (e.g. cycling time trials) a value up to 90%HRmax is not uncommon, whereas for an athlete in an endurance sport where effort changes are significant (e.g. cycling road races) a value below 80%HRmax is not unknown.
The LT threshold can be increased by suitable training.
Your question is a valid one, but comes down to not appreciating the assumptions you have implicitly made.
The HRmax formula is commonly quoted, and often is built in to computer controlled gym equipment. When I used a stepper regularly at a gym I had to knock 35 years off my actual age in order to allow the machine to generate the workout I wanted.
Two years later... :)
19th Jun '08, 2:26pm
Just wanted to say thanks D. and Donald for the good advice. I had meant to reply, but then I ended up in middle of the mountains in Montana with no computer for the summer. :)
D. - I did my lactate testing based upon Outside Magazine's program (linked in the first post). I haven't heard of LTP, but I'll read up on it. You were right - aerobic endurance runner. I don't compete. Running was partially to get in shape for soccer, though now it's mostly just to keep me in shape for any activity in which I may participate: hiking, dancing, climbing, soccer, etc. And now I'll finally check out that article on TRimps.
Donald - Good reasoning; I like your style. You must be a philosopher and logician. :) Guess I wasn't thinking too clearly, but then, that's not uncommon for me. And I imagine you're right about the MHR: probably around 212. I've seen it hit 210 during a very hard workout. Oh, and my mum says I'm a whiz when it comes to remembering my age, but I still need to work on my remembering-to-stop-by -and-mow-the-lawn skills.
Not really sure where I fit in these days: probably somewhere between biking, running, hiking and fiddling. I guess I'll have to reevaluate things now. Thanks again for the information. It is appreciated.
Nate